Sex & The Divine (Not Divine Sex)

The sinfulness of sexual pleasure has always had more than a fair bit to do with the sinfulness of woman.

From an essay by Francine Prose at Lapham’s Quarterly:

The debate over sex with the beautiful versus sex with the ugly had its twisted roots in the belief that there was an almost mathematical ratio between pleasure and sin. The greater the pleasure, the worse the evil. Apparently, too, there also was considerable worry about ejaculation as something that drains and weakens the male, a dangerous process in general and particularly in the presence of the predatory woman who, unlike her mate, doesn’t lose in sex a life-sustaining fluid. The rabbinic admonition to think of a woman as “a pitcher of filth with its mouth full of blood” was echoed in the work of the twelfth-century theologian Petrus Cantor. “Consider that the most lovely woman has come into being from a foul-smelling drop of semen; then consider her midpoint, how she is a container of filth; and after that consider her end, when she will be food for worms.”  [too much more]

Robert George on  heterosexual marital sex and hating anything else:

… the argument for marriage between a man and a woman can require “somewhat technical philosophical analysis.” It is a two-step case that starts with marriage and works its way back to sex. First, he contends that marriage is a uniquely “comprehensive” union, meaning that it is shared at several different levels at once — emotional, spiritual and bodily. “And the really interesting evidence that it is comprehensive is that it is anchored in bodily sharing,” he says.“Ordinary friendships wouldn’t be friendships anymore if they involved bodily sharing,” he explained to me. “If I, despite being a married man, had this female friend of mine and I said, ‘Well, gosh, why don’t we do some bodily sharing,’ and we had straightforward sexual intercourse, well, that wouldn’t be friendship or marriage. It is bodily, O.K., but it is not part of a comprehensive sharing of life. My comprehensive sharing of life is with my wife, which I just now violated.” But just as friendships with sex are not friendships, marriage without sex is not marriage. Sex, George said, is the key to this “comprehensive unity.” He then imagined himself as a man with no interest in sex who proposed to seal a romance by committing to play tennis only with his beloved. Breaking that promise, he said, would not be adultery.

The second step is more complicated, and more graphic. George argues that only vaginal intercourse — “procreative-type” sex acts, as George puts it — can consummate this “multilevel” mind-body union. Only in reproduction, unlike digestion, circulation, respiration or any other bodily function, do two individuals perform a single function and thus become, in effect, “one organism.” Each opposite-sex partner is incomplete for the task; yet together they create a “one-flesh union,” in the language of Scripture. “Their bodies become one (they are biologically united, and do not merely rub together) in coitus (and only in coitus), similarly to the way in which one’s heart, lungs and other organs form a unity by coordinating for the biological good of the whole,” George writes in a draft of his latest essay on the subject. Unloving sex between married partners does not perform the same multilevel function, he argues, nor does oral or anal sex — even between loving spouses.

Infertile couples, too, are performing this uniquely shared reproductive function, George says, even if they know their sperm and ovum cannot complete it. Marriage is designed in part for procreation in the way a baseball team is designed for winning games, he says, but “people who can practice baseball can be teammates without victories on the field.”  [ewww more]

From Johann Hari at the New Statesman:

After all the arguments for subordinating women have been shown to be self-serving lies, what are misogynists left with? They have only one feeble argument that is still deferred to and shown undeserving respect across the world, even by people who should know better: “God told me to. I have to treat women as lesser beings, because it is inscribed in my Holy Book.”

Ophelia Benson and Jeremy Stangroom are the editors of Butterflies and Wheels, the best atheist site on the web. In Does God Hate Women? they forensically dismantle the last respectable misogyny. They argue: “What would otherwise look like stark bullying is very often made respectable and holy by a putative religious law or aphorism or scriptural quotation . . . They worship a God who is a male who gangs up with other males against women. They worship a thug.”

Every major religion’s texts were written at a time when women were regarded as little better than talking cattle. Their words and commands reflect this, plainly and bluntly. This book starts with a panoramic sweep across the world, showing – with archetypal cases – how every religion has groups today thumping women down with its Holy Book.  [the review carries on]

Christianity & Feminism

I tend to agree with this:

Judging by the response to her Comment is free piece last week, I’m obviously not the only one who was stunned by Julie Burchill’s assertion that in her latest incarnation as a “Christian Zionist, a Christian feminist, and a Christian socialist,” she now believes “literally, in the God of the Old Testament”. As dozens of posters pointed out, the term “Christian feminist” is an oxymoron; it’s a glaring contradiction in terms on a par with “compassionate conservative” and “pro-life anti-abortionist”.

Christianity is and always has been antithetical to women’s freedom and equality, but it’s certainly not alone in this. Whether it’s one of the world’s major faiths or an off-the-wall cult, religion means one thing and one thing only for those women unfortunate enough to get caught up in it: oppression. It’s the patriarchy made manifest, male-dominated, set up by men to protect and perpetuate their power.

Since men first conceived of the notion of a single omnipotent creator, that divine being has taken the form of a man: no matter what name he answers to, be it Yahweh, Jehovah, Allah, or just plain God, what’s not in doubt is that he’s a he. His teachings and his various holy books reinforce the message that this life exists for men, while the best women can hope for is some kind of reward in the next one; as long as we do as we’re told of course, without questioning our lords and masters, and as long as we manage to remain pure of heart and mind while we prostrate ourselves at their feet.

Like a lot of people, I’ve dabbled with various religions over the years, but each time it was my feminism that proved my downfall: from the Rastafarian ex-boyfriend who refused to let me touch any living thing during that time of the month when I was allegedly “unclean”, to the happy-clappy church that took my purchase of a non-gender-specific Bible as evidence that I had a heritage of witchcraft in my family, and that reassured me I would one day be reunited with the foetus I’d had aborted (now there’s an encounter to look forward to!) Whatever it was I was looking for when I crossed these hallowed thresholds, I came away with no more than a growing comprehension that it was all a con: Jesus doesn’t want me for a sunbeam; indeed, there’s no room even in the stable for women like me.

From the very first days of feminism there’s been a recognition that religious doctrine is incompatible with the quest for women’s rights. As Susan B Anthony said way back in the 19th century: “The worst enemy women have is in the pulpit.” Or as Helen H Gardener put it in 1885 in Men, Women, and Gods:

This religion and the Bible require of woman everything, and give her nothing. They ask her support and her love, and repay her with contempt and oppression … Every injustice that has ever been fastened upon women in a Christian country has been ‘authorised by the Bible’ and riveted and perpetuated by the pulpit.

And so it goes on today. In any society where religion dominates it is women who pay the price: we can argue until we’re blue in the face about whether or not any particular religion sanctions so-called honour crimes for example, but what’s unarguable is that men’s interpretation of religion, and the patriarchal values that religion instils, has led to the murders of countless women. Similarly, it’s in the name of religion that girls are denied an education; in the name of religion that more than half a million women die every year because they cannot access safe abortions; in the name of religion that Aids continues its unrelenting progress across Africa, and in the name of religion that women throughout the world remain subjugated, impoverished and denied individual agency.

I try to practice tolerance of religion and religious practises but I don’t always do that easily.  Whether or not certain practises are rightly associated with any religion, nevertheless, some are associated with mainstream religions or with radical, fundamentalist versions of them.

But even if we take out things like honour killings and the notion that women should subject themselves to their husbands in all matters, I’m still not sure that there’s a mainstream religion that can pass my “feminist sniff-out-the-sexism” test.

I’ll speak of the religious cult I know best which is Roman Catholicism.  There were things I loved about my religion, though I remain unsure that any of the things I loved really had anything to do with belief in the God.

I loved the words of the Bible to the extent that they approach poetry.  I loved the liturgy for similar reasons.  I have a love of ritual – candles, incense, certain word patterns accompanying the liturgical calendar or life events like birth, marriage and death.  Well, I didn’t always love all the words, but I’m hoping you get the idea. 

I miss those things and have found them almost irreplaceable.  My own poetry and the poetry of others certainly replaces liturgy and the Bible, though I’ve not found a way to make certain words, word patterns and the traditions and rituals associated with them a part of my everyday life.  Affirmations and such just feel articial to me. 

As for ritual, I miss it the most.  The mystery invoked, the sense of belonging to a crew that’s been doing something close to the same thing for centuries, the community of people giving praise or mourning together – the rituals that many people have adapted can come close to replacing these old ways, but only close.  New ways of doing funerals or memorial services created by the gay community during the great early losses of the AIDS crisis come closest.  The fact is, though, it takes a long time to make a “tradition”.  That doesn’t mean it’s not worth doing, just that it won’t fill the hole for me in my lifetime.  And it would be awfully nice if I could find something while I’m still alive!

While I don’t want to minimise the importance of words, music and ritual, what of the deeper aspects of being in touch with a community that can express some of our longing for contact with “the divine” or a transcendant sense of what it’s all about, here on earth?  Where do I connect with mystery and that which can’t be explained?

For a long time, I did that within Roman Catholicism, despite my profound reservations.  I stayed away from the fetus freaks and prayed with the women of my Church that Il Papa might be moved, one day soon, to allowing women to take their rightful places as leaders in the Church.  We were “the faithful in waiting”.  I read Rosemary Reuther and Mary Daly and I contented myself with working toward what I most wanted and with waiting.

Till I could wait no more.  That is, when they started reading shit like this from the pulpit of my parish church:

The majority of Canadians understand marriage to be the union of a man and a woman, faithful in love and open to the gift of life. Marriage and the family are the foundations of society, through which children are brought into this world and nurtured as they grow to adulthood. As such, the family is a more fundamental social institution than the state, and the strength of the family is vital for the well-being of our whole society.

Since homosexuality, adultery, prostitution and pornography undermine the foundations of the family, the basis of society, then the state must use its coercive power to proscribe or curtail them in the interests of the common good.

It is sometimes argued that what we do in the privacy of our home is nobody’ s business. While the privacy of the home is undoubtedly sacred, it is not absolute. Furthermore, an evil act remains an evil act whether it is performed in public or private.

Personal choice is exercised both in opting for the marital state and in the choice of one’s spouse. However, the future spouses are not free to alter marriage’s essential purpose or properties. These do not depend on the will or the sexual orientation of the contracting parties. They are rooted in natural law and do not change.

I sat in the third pew the day they read that shit.  I cried as it was read but forced myself to stay put until it was done, making quite sure not to stifle my occasional sobs.  When the speaking was done and in the silence before the liturgy resumed, I stood up and walked very slowly down the centre aisle of my church and out the door.  When I got home, I sat down and wrote letters to the Cardinal who was overseeing the archdiocese of Toronto at that time and to the pastor of my church.  I never heard back.

I don’t regret walking out and I won’t ever go back.  Every now and then, I hope that my walk down the aisle helped a gay or lesbian church member or his/her parents.  How they stay alive in the face of such hate speech is beyond me.  Meantime, the fucking church gets all upset and pissed off and spreads fear that its refusal to welcome gays and lesbians (lets not even think about trans folk here because it just can’t be done) may make it vulnerable to human rights claims.  Oh right, the church is so oppressed!

There are mainstream churches whose stances toward abortion, homosexuality,  the ordination of women and social justice issues I admire, like the United Church and the Universalist Unitarians.  And there are people whose religious feelings I admire, like this blogger.  But I’m more inclined to feel about christianity and christians the way that apostate feels about Islam and Muslims. 

Sometimes I have to dig deep for my tolerance, sometimes not so deep.  Maybe the personal hurt I experienced at the hands of my church has fucked me up irrevocably.  Maybe the hurt just allowed me to step far back enough to see what I needed to see, what was there to be seen.  Or, maybe my faith just isn’t and wasn’t ever strong enough to withstand critical analysis.  And that, too, would be fine with me.

I have no difficulty doing my social justice work outside the church and sometimes, it’s much easier.  I have no problem at all being a feminist outside my church.  Within, I found it impossible.  Some women manage to live with the contradictions.  After all, it’s not as though life outside the mainstream churches is without contradiction.  There were just a few too many of those for me.

UPDATE:  One further thought about contradiction – if we define the cultures of the world as patriarchal, as many feminists do, me included, then we live with inordinately stressful contradiction every moment of our lives.  I don’t notice anyone jumping off the planet.  What I mean to say is, yes, the religions that I know exist on a continuum of patriarchal oppression ranging from the mild to the extreme, just like so many social institutions we live within.  We tolerate a good deal because we have no choice in many instances.  And we shout about it when we have the chance.  Why should our lives in spirit be any different?  We make choices.  I have made mine, for now, with respect to religion.  I have room for those who have made different decisions.

I’m enjoying this conversation, of sorts, with purtek.  I think because it’s real and true and respectful at the same time.  A rare thing these days …

As the Globe Falls

I was so conscious of my deliberation the first time I used “swear” words that I have an indelible memory of it.  I was likely about six-years old.  Someone had given me one of those wonderful globes with a scene inside.  When you held the globe (made of glass in those days) upside down, snow filled it and covered the delicious little house and garden inside.

I loved that little globe.  One day, while watching the snow fall,  I dropped the globe and it smashed on the floor, leaving a pool of water filled with gloppy white stuff and a shattered, imaginary world.

I had no one to blame.  No one but god who, I thought in that moment, was the only “person” who could have saved the globe.  And didn’t.  The problem of theodicy, right there in my little-girl bedroom.  All my childlike anger at the injustices of the world  became concentrated on that mucky pool of liquid.

In some ways, only in some ways, I had led a remarkably sheltered life.  My mother occasionally said “damn” and always apologized.  I knew there were “bad words” but I knew very few of them.  I had been taught that both my anger itself and expressions of it were “bad”.  And I was a little Catholic girl, sent off to catechism classes regularly.  I knew my ten commandments and was imaginative to boot.  I believed god fully capable of striking blasphemers dead on the spot.

Through some unclear collision of all those factors, I was quite sure that the absolute most rebellious and risky expression of my anger was to swear at god. 

“Shit bugger damn you, god,” is what I said to my empty bedroom.  Empty but for my god.

Then I waited to be struck dead, half in fear, but with a good deal of curiosity. Clearly, the seeds of doubt had already been sown.  Nothing happened, of course, nothing but the thrill of having transgressed in a way that was both almost unthinkable and absolutely private.

I never confessed to having taken the name of the lord in vain and I had my first experiece of doubting his existence because of his failure to take his revenge.

Ironic, isn’t it?  My faith was threatened because of the failure of this vengeful, not-very-Xian god to exert control over a member of his flock.  Some years later, when trying to reconcile all the lies I’d been told by my religion and about my religion, it occurred to me for the first time that god may have forgiven me for my pretty harmless outburst of anger, even though I’d asked for no forgiveness.  Or maybe even that god didn’t consider expressions of anger with no victim worth his notice.

My theories of life and the universe don’t now include the conversations that god might be having with himself.  I’m sure all the theologians out there are greatly relieved.

Still, perhaps because of the ways my brain was washed, perhaps for reasons that I know not of, I still think of myself as having been the recipient of “grace” that day.  I expressed my anger and no harm came of it.  Not even to me.  Or maybe no harm came because of the way I expressed it.  That experience did contribute to the formation of either superego or conscience, depending on how you choose to see it.

I’ve been wondering lately about the anger that gets tossed around by bloggers all over the sphere, including myself.  I’ve been wondering that perhaps especially since Jim David Adkisson killed two people and wounded others at TVUUC, quite possibly after reading and listening to people such as Bill O’Reilly, Sean Hannity and Ann Coulter.

I wonder it when I think about how I want to respond to the now famous “pro-feminist” blogger, Kyle Payne, who recently said, among other things, this:

While caring for the female student, I felt a sudden impulse to expose her breast. Not knowing how to deal with this feeling at the time – and to put it more clearly, not knowing how to make sense of such an urge, given my personal values and my politics – I acted upon it. With a digital camera I kept with me regularly, I briefly photographed and took a few seconds of video of the woman’s breast. She did not consent to this act, nor did she have any knowledge of it at the time. This event ended as quickly as it began, leaving me in a state of disbelief at what I had done.

Something that Hugo Schwyzer said in response to the TVUUC shootings comes to mind as I try to decide on my response:

Those of us who speak publicly or prophetically have a moral obligation to think about how the least balanced of our students, the least well-equipped of our followers, the least stable of our adherents might respond to what it is we say in anger. That doesn’t mean never speaking out against what we regard as sinful or destructive. I’m still going to lament the grave harm done by vivisection, factory farming, and the adult entertainiment industry. But I’m reminded by this incident of the challenge to be grace-filled, and of the challenge to avoid causing others to stumble. Someone — or a whole lot of someones — convinced Jim Adkisson that liberal Unitarians were deserving not only of his wrath, but of destruction. Though the legal punishment should fall on Adkisson alone, the moral culpability for his action is, I think, far more widely shared.

These comments moved me and I thought, with some guilt, of the instances on this blog when I’ve indulged my anger in not very constructive ways.  I think of these words now, when I examine my response to Kyle Payne.  I want to write an adult version of “shit bugger damn you, god”, whatever that might be.  Yet I think that’s unhelpful.  Not with respect to Payne, whose well-being is not in my hands.  It doesn’t help me.  And it doesn’t help anyone who reads what I write.

Don’t get me wrong, I believe that Payne needs to be called out and held accountable, not only for what he’s done, but for what he continues to do by writing this self-serving crap.  Many people have called Payne out on their blogs and I trust they’ll continue to do so as long as he’s around.  Pretty clear he’s dangerous.

But there’s an awful lot of ad hominem stuff too.  It might seem rather odd that I’d make that point about someone who has done so much to attract that kind of attention.  But it does us no harm to step back and look at the issues for at least a tiny moment.

I’m not going to cover the issue of men being “feminists” because I actually think it’s the least important of all. 

I want to try to respond to this:

As I have undergone a full psychological evaluation and begun a treatment program for various mental health issues, I am learning more and more each day about what factors led me to commit the act I have described. My experiences of child sexual abuse have produced a great deal of unresolved anger, primarily because I was unable to obtain necessary support during that period and have since worked very hard to repress those memories. That unresolved anger at the injustice and violation done to me is what led me initially to anti-rape work as a rape crisis advocate when I started college. I felt that helping others might allow me to find some sort of peace with what happened to me. Being an advocate did help me to better understand the socio-political context of my experiences of abuse, particularly as I began reading feminist theory. However, because I concentrated my energy solely on an advocacy role for others, rather than addressing my own experiences of abuse, nothing got better. In fact, things got much worse.

Where to start?  Let’s try this:  it’s very difficult to believe Payne at this point.  He has, in the recent past, denied the charges against him.  Apart from that, the man lived a lie in professing to be an advocate for women when he was using women and his self-description as a feminist to further his own predatory desires.  It’s always really hard for me to believe that the only criminal activity a person has engaged in is that for which he’s been charged.  I am fairly sure that only the tip of Payne’s iceberg is being dealt with.

And he was so focussed on advocating for others that he forgot about his own pain?  Gimme a break.  While therapists who don’t attend to themselves often burn out, they don’t sexually assault their clients while they’re doing it.  What a wonderful excuse.  I was so busy looking after that woman, I accidentally assaulted her.

But, putting my suspicions aside just for a moment, how ought Payne to be dealt with if he is telling the truth about his sexual abuse as a child?  He wonders how he might be re-admitted to the hallowed halls of feminism and even to work as a counsellor.  Here’s how one blogger responds:

Listen, you fucking moron asshole, YOU VIOLATED that woman. Period. End game. Who is to blame? YOU! Got it, jerk? YOU. I hope to ALL that is sane or holy YOU pay for it. You have NO place in feminist spaces, no place where victimized women might be, no place speaking for or with us, you stain. YOU are a predator, got it?

To that I can only say, right on.  Why?  Because Kyle Payne doesn’t get it.  And, since he still doesn’t seem able to truly contemplate the damage he has done and focuses only on himself and the ways in which his own predatory behaviour is related to sexual violence done to him, I’d have to say he hasn’t even begun.

In any case, no one who has abused the trust of vulnerable women by abusing their position ought ever to be placed in that position again, no matter what, and no matter the success of his “treatment”.  That conclusion is not based upon my wish to impose punishment on Mr. Payne, that decision is based on an absolute need for commitment to prevent this particular perpetrator from abusing the trust of someone else, based on his position. 

It’s also based on empirical data [pdf].  For instance: 

On average, sexual offenders who received treatment were less likely to reoffend than offenders who did not receive treatment. Not all treatments were equally effective. Treatments provided prior to 1980 appeared to have little effect. In contrast, current treatments were associated with a significant reduction in both sexual recidivism (from 17% to 10%) and general recidivism (51% to 32%).

That’s a reduction in recidivism.  As long as there exists a possibility that a person such as Payne will re-offend, such a person should never be placed in a position of trust with respect to women or children.  Period.  Absolutely period.  To do so would be criminally negligent.

Contrary to popular opinion, rates of recidivism  [pfd] for sexual offenders are lower than for other crimes (at least, rates of those charged and convicted).  But some people, like me, think that may mean that the most effective “treament” is catching offenders and punishing them according to law.  The reason I think that may work is because it interferes with the belief, common to sex offenders, that they are above or beyond the law, that they are acting in some private realm of shame and shaming.  Once they become aware that their actions may be subject to public exposure and reproach, they quit, as the results are unsatisfactory.  The power and control are gone.  And it’s the power and control that are really in play.  Kyle Payne is still trying to exert power and control through his blog writings.

 

There’s your answer Kyle.  You can’t ever come back.  That’s the price you pay.  It’s an awfully small price, compared from the one you’ve extracted from the woman (women?) you’ve criminally abused.  But even if it weren’t, I wouldn’t care.  A high price is called for. 
That Payne doesn’t know that is proof of the extremely early and limited state of his own counselling.  Anyone aware of the damage done to them by sexual abuse and assault would know this.  Anyone treating Payne from within a “feminist framework” would know this too.

Go do your work in treatment, Kyle.  Pay the price you are asked to pay at law.  And stop asking for the misty eyes of the women whose community you’ve hurt. 

Just one more thing before I end this excessively lengthy rumination.  The “abuse excuse”. 

There is surely no question that male (and some female – but we’re talking about a man here) victims of childhood sexual abuse very often go on to become predators.  That doesn’t make them insane adults who are neither morally nor criminally responsible:

Statistics involving men in New Jersey prisons convicted of sexual abuse, found that over 95% of the men, were in fact abused themselves. And we don’t know, but it could be that the 5% of non-abused men in that case don’t remember being abused as children; they may have amnesia or a traumatic dissociation.. Some abuse may be the attempt to relive one’s own abuse, with power roles reversed. Another reason may be these people have learned that abuse is a way of feeling in control. Fundamentally, in all cases of abuse, it certainly is about power and control.    […]  It’s a complex and still unclear set of issues that drives childhood sexual abuse. However, it is up to adults to control their own behaviors.

Once again, here’s how Payne describes what he did:

While caring for the female student, I felt a sudden impulse to expose her breast. Not knowing how to deal with this feeling at the time – and to put it more clearly, not knowing how to make sense of such an urge, given my personal values and my politics – I acted upon it. With a digital camera I kept with me regularly, I briefly photographed and took a few seconds of video of the woman’s breast. She did not consent to this act, nor did she have any knowledge of it at the time. This event ended as quickly as it began, leaving me in a state of disbelief at what I had done.

That’s the excuse of a child with his hand in a cookie jar:  woops, my hand slipped.  Give that one a rest, Kyle.  You say you didn’t know what to do with the urge?  That suggests you thought about what to do with it.  You know what the answer ought to have been.  You had time to think about it.  You had time to erase the photographs you took.  You had time to find treatment and confess what you’d done.  Apparently, you did none of that until, thankfully, you were caught and stopped.  I hope your therapist tells you what to do with that urge the next time you have it.  If not, check back here.

Or, you know Kyle, read your own fucking blog:

When faced with a message that challenges men’s violence, rather than reacting defensively […] we can call into question our own attitudes and behaviors about gender, sexuality, and power.

Shit bugger damn you, Kyle Payne.

 

Cara did a great job on this, with links and A#1 comments.

UPDATE:  Check Ren’s blog for a list of feminist and pro-feminist posts on Payne.

Will the “Real” Jeremiah Wright … Do We Know Him?

What is the meaning/what are the meanings of the words that the Reverend Jeremiah Wright has spoken in the last few days, in an interview with Bill Moyers on PBS (watch the whole interview  here  ) and during several press conferences today?  I suppose that many of us, no doubt viewing ourselves as intelligent people, think that we are in a position to decide (I’m talking about white folk in particular).  I don’t think so.  At least, we are not in that position immediately.  We have a lot of work to do first.

I’m not a racialized person living in America.  I assume that racialized people living in America have a lot to tell me before I might begin to understand their experience and their relationship to power, politics, the media etc.  I like the Reverend and I can relate to much of what he says, even his speech after 9/11.  But many people don’t like what he’s said, including Barack Obama apparently.  I’ve read some of the Reverend’s sermons, listened to videos of ENTIRE sermons and done some reading, as well as listening to African Americans and their responses on tv news shows.  I might be starting to APPROACH an understanding of what Wright’s sermons mean to his parishioners.  Yet others feel free to speak conclusively about what he means, immediately, without looking deeper, without speaking to people whose interpretations may be more accurate.  That’s dumb but more importantly, it’s racist.  It’s not a discussion or a conversation.  It’s privilege utilizing privilege and dominance to determine meaning.

Moreoever, I don’t describe myself as a Christian, though that is in my history.  I know nothing at all of the “prophetic tradition” in African American churches.  I have a good background for coming to an understanding and I’ve taken steps in that direction.  But I don’t pretend to understand as yet.  Until I do, beyond saying that I can relate to the Reverend and his people, I cannot judge.

With respect to Barack Obama, if anything, I’m disappointed that he has “renounced” these sermons of Rev. Wright.  I’d have thought a lot more of him if, as part of the discussion he urges upon his fellow Americans, he helped them towards an understanding of his long-time pastor, a man he clearly admires and only looks hypocritical distancing himself from.

Until I learn more, this will have to do:

First, a reminder of the incendiary, flame-hot words of one of America’s righteous heroes, Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. –

“God didn’t call America to engage in a senseless, unjust war. . . . And we are criminals in that war. We’ve committed more war crimes almost than any nation in the world, and I’m going to continue to say it. And we won’t stop it because of our pride and our arrogance as a nation. But God has a way of even putting nations in their place…[God will say:] And if you don’t stop your reckless course, I’ll rise up and break the backbone of your power.” 

MLK has God telling his people, “his” America, that he will rise up and break its backbone?  Not gentle words.  And more than gentle words were needed.  Tell me, if anyone had listened to words such as those spoken by Rev. Wright in 2001, where might America be just now? where might the world be?

If you want to read another opinion about Rev. Wright, check E.J. Dionne Jr.,    here

And this:

How dare Reverend Wright and King violate their assigned space! Next thing you know, they’ll be sitting in the front row of the bus, scaring the bejesus out of the bus driver and the proper people. All of whom can respond with anger. It’s right there, in the rulebook.   here

And, on March 29th when the first “Wright wars” raged, here’s David Newiert’s take on the brouhaha:

The Washington Post’s report on Obama’s speech observed that this was a controversy that “threatens to engulf his presidential candidacy.” Yet as far as anyone can tell, it was having only a marginal effect on the polls in the race before it blew up on the networks, and it was not generated by either of Obama’s political opponents, or by any particular interest groups.

No, this is a controversy cooked up almost entirely within the media realm. Once they sank their fangs into it, the whole zombielike corps of pundits, cable talking heads, and radio talk-show hosts couldn’t let go of it. And equally remarkable was the bias that was on display in discussing it: News anchors and talking heads flatly referred to the Rev. Jeremiah Wright’s videotaped remarks as “anti-American,” “hate-filled,” “vicious,” “offensive,” and so on and on.

It’s telling that none of them also observed that, for the most part, Wright’s remarks (aside from his conspiracist comments about AIDS, which were indeed inexcusable, but which received little or no play before Obama’s speech) were factually accurate, and deeply reflective of a reality that most African Americans live with — and which most white Americans do their best to ignore, deny, and forget. The remarks that were broadcast all over YouTube and replayed endlessly on the cable talk shows were, no doubt, were impolitic, but they were also largely true.

 more at firedoglake

And more today from peterr at firedoglake:

Let me start with some disclosure: I know Jeremiah Wright. I’ve worshiped at Trinity United Church of Christ a time or two. I’ve heard Wright speak at clergy conferences. I’ve had a couple of one-on-one conversations with him.

With that said . . . Oh, that man can preach. But as any preacher will tell you, it helps if people would listen. As a preacher with some 20+ years of my own experience in the pulpit, I shudder to think what would happen if some of my sermons were snipped and sliced and diced in the same manner as those of Jeremiah Wright.

The most lamentable aspect of the way Wright has been swift-boated is the manner in which his critics snipped his quotes out of context. CNN’s Roland Martin, underneath the broader radar of the media, noted that Jeremiah Wright’s now-infamous sermon addressing 9/11 was completely misrepresented:

One of the most controversial statements in this sermon was when he mentioned “chickens coming home to roost.” He was actually quoting Edward Peck, former U.S. Ambassador to Iraq and deputy director of President Reagan’s terrorism task force, who was speaking on FOX News. That’s what he told the congregation.

To hear the media speak about it, though, this was Wright trying to burn down the White House. I’m not surprised that you didn’t hear this on Fox — though the initial interview with Peck took place on Fox! — but the fact that the media missed this is stunning. Even on CNN, apart from the blog post, you’d never get the idea that their reporters ever listened to the whole sermon. and judging from this morning’s performance by reporters at Wright’s appearance at the National Press Club, they’re still not listening.   more here

And while we’re reading and learning and trying to catch up, those of us who are NOT African Americans, let’s remember that African America is made up of multiple communities and many, many people with a wide variety of experience and interpretations of their own.  I know this is a bit of a rant and I do try to avoid that.  Can’t help it on this one.